Arbitrary Minimafia [MAFIA WIN]

Umm so I've been thinking a lot about this all day.

I think the best course of action is to no lynch.

I agree with nautilus that it's unlikely that mafia has a vigilante kind of role, so I think that if we no lynch today then there's likely no way for mafia to kill two people tonight, which would mean that we're guaranteed to at least get to D2. We only get one lynch attempt, since if we lynch correctly we win and if we lynch incorrectly we lose, but if we stall until D2 it's still the same situation, but we have better odds of actually catching the mafia.

And if there are any helpful town roles that might stall the end of game or give us information, like for example doctor, bulletproof or investigation, then I think by NLing today we could give them a chance to act one more night.

A-also we're running out of time in the phase anyway so! ;v;

vote: no lynch

But if you guys disagree I can change my vote.

I was a bit tied up with the roleplay minigame thread, but I've been monitoring this one. I'm leaning towards Vote: No Lynch as well, but I plan to get a larger post in before rollover. I just figured I should post something in the interim.

Also, I think since Alice is on a much different timezone, she probably won't be around until after rollover. So, don't expect anything from her right this moment.

To elaborate on my vigilante point:

If mafia had an extra vigilante kill (that is, they had a gun and could shoot people with it on top of their regular NK), that would be incredibly overpowered unless there were bulletproof individuals in the town. Mafia could easily start off the game with both of their kills, rendering the town ratio 1:2 off the bat and creating a MYLO situation immediately. The same logic would go for roles that could double vote, but looking at the list of EM roles there aren't any that can do that as far as I know, so.

Also: roles that require a role on the town side are roles that are essentially vanilla if their "complement" role doesn't exist - for example, a framer who can change the investigation result of a player is worthless if there's no investigative roles. Something to keep in mind.

Kiyoko isn't that mean. And neither is giant death rectangle.

Like I said, I'm fairly okay with either no lynching or lynching since the pros and cons of both are reliant on the existence of certain roles in the town. However, thinking about it, I would actually not advocate a mass-claim for the following reasons:

- The mafia can deliberately be the last to claim or wait until other claims are made, size up the other claims, and then claim a role that cannot be proved and does not overlap with existing claims
- The mafia can claim an investigative role, and I think I mentioned this scenario in my first post

Finally: to giant rectangle in the sky, @Kiyoko: Are stuns and jails the only abilities we will see in rollover, or can other abilities (should they exist)
appear in rollover as well?

EDIT: Upon previewing this post I see that the general consensus of the thread is to no lynch, so I'm fine with that too. o/ vote: no lynch

nautilus wrote:Finally: to giant rectangle in the sky, @Kiyoko: Are stuns and jails the only abilities we will see in rollover, or can other abilities (should they exist)
appear in rollover as well?

Just stuns and jails.

████████████████ VOTE TALLY

alcasync vs no lynch
Luxaria vs no lynch
nautilus vs no lynch

No Lynch █ █ █

I'm having some trouble getting each role's page to load on the EpicMafia website. Also, a lot of the ones I did see I found to be ambiguous. We do not know how Kiyoko might have adapted something to the forum format. For example, in your list of roles that were unlikely for mafia, you said

Hooker (no action shown in rollover, this is a role that the mafia probably would want to use

On the website, Hooker reads as

Visits one person every night.
Any role that visits will be role blocked.

The presence of a role like this would suggest that we happen to have one or two other roles that can cause actions on other players in the night--which, admittedly, we have no evidence of currently. However, it would be a very conditional role in that first the single mafia has to place it on one of (initially) four players, and then hope that one of the other three players selected that single player as target for their role. At this point, it would be blocked. Kiyoko said "only stuns and jails" would show up in the rollover--would this count under that category?

I'm not saying this role is in the game, bear in mind, but it is a very conditional role that adds to the very cutthroat 5-person (now 4-person) guessing game that we have going on. The point that it is conditional is the key thing, I think. I agree with your assessment that Kiyoko would not have given mafia double the kill-power, as that's just a swift death for town. Even if town had some sort of protection, it still feels far too straight-forward for this type of minigame.

Could mafia have something relating to votes? Not sure. If we figure right now that we have only a max total of four votes, mafia having access to a form of vote manipulation gives them a large advantage. An example of conditional and related to voting would be an adaptation of the Interrogator. In the event of no lynch, mafia might have the ability to stun another player or some such.

I'll avoid rambling, but the points I'm trying to make are:

1. We don't know exactly how these roles were adapted, and if certain ones would show up at all.
2. I think very conditional roles are the most likely possibility for both town and mafia. I think town might have one protective role as a fail-safe.
3. I agree that mafia probably do not have any way to directly kill another player.

This game is really weird to parse due to how ambiguous the roles are, and, also, how little we can test alliances. I am pretty much banking on the idea/hope that we will get enough information from this upcoming night phase for the two (three, if we're lucky) town players to successfully pin a mafia lynch.

████████████████ NIGHT ONE

Nobody was lynched. The rectangle hungers. It looms in the shadows of your waking hours, fetid breath hot against the back of your throat.

Sweet dreams.

Night One will end on Monday, June 22, at 9:00pm PST.

1. We don't know exactly how these roles were adapted, and if certain ones would show up at all.

The answer I was given was that there were minimal changes to the roles unless there was some gameplay mechanic that had to be adapted for a forum based game. For example, EpicMafia employs the usage of whispers and other methods to allow players to communicate with the host or other players anonymously (as well as a living will system). Obviously there's no real way to incorporate things such as whispers (as direct communication with other players can be a PM alliance sort of deal), so something like the Whisperer:

EpicMafia wrote:-Can send anonymous messages to players
-Sided with the mafia

could be plausibly changed to

My best Kiyoko impression wrote:You are the whisperer, you may send anonymous messages to players, PM me the anonymous message and I will send it to the recipient

The answer implied that there isn't anything like "this role can act every night on EM, but can act only once in this game".

For the record, my role is word for word exactly as it says on the EM website, so I'm also using my own role as a frame of reference.

Re: hooker - I presume since the role explicitly states that someone's power is blocked, that would fall under a stun.

---

I refuse to submit to you, rectangle. I refuse to cower to your will. Unlike most in this thread, I do not fear your presence, and I refuse to bow to you. I am unafraid of your rectangular grasp, and as I walk through the shadow of the valley of death, I am unafraid of your polygonal threats.

Also you need a mint.

Oh man, this game is full of smart people and here I am headdesking on my keyboard hoping to type out something intelligent.

RECTANGLE-KUN PLEASE JUST LET ME BE OKAY, THIS IS NOT FINE.

I'm glad that no one was lynched, since that seemed like the best course of action.

I've checked the EpicMafia list and my role is also word for word. It's not a role that's as interesting as Hooker or Whisperer though. I'm not sure what else to say at this point, since one of us is going to die and all we can do is wait.

Also this post is short because I don't know what else to talk about. I don't suspect anyone so far.

This game is giving me a headache.

I'll sit here and try to figure out if I can develop a read on anyone. I'll say something like, "Oh, hm, well normally I always favor Alice since she's my OTP irl, but what if she is mafia? You know, she's kind of gone along with what's been said, but that's also partly her playstyle. I think she might be the mafia. I think it could make sense."

But then I'll say to myself, "Wait, Luxaria, if Alice is suspect for not really doing much of anything, why not have the inverse be true? Nautilus has contributed so much. In a short game like this where the mafia is only looking out for themself, it would be easy to disguise yourself as town by playing a super strong town game. But does it make sense to suspect someone playing hard town as mafia? I suppose so, so Nautilus is pretty suspicious, too. But wait, then that means Alcasync might as well be suspicious since, like Alice, she's been a bit ambiguous, but also town-leaning, if one can lean either which way in a 4-person sudden death."

Around this point I realize I've just accused all three of you. "Okay," I say to myself, "let's start from the top with Nautilus, since she's playing the perfect ruse. You know, a mafia flying solo has nothing to lose by completely guiding town and making suggestions. It's not like they can implicate an ally or anything. But. You know, returning back to what I said, what makes Nautilus more maf than Alice or Alca? I guess nothing, really, so am I just being weird?"

"Augh!" I then think to myself. "This is just not working out. Okay, Alcasync is mafia. This is it. She has to be mafia. She seems to favor playing an ambiguous start with town-leaning tendencies. It's perfect. She blends in as town or mafia right now. She's made suggestions that seem so town friendly that it would be perfect if she were mafia... but then so have both Nautilus and Alice... I mean... what really distinguishes one from the other? We've said nothing other than field ideas of claiming and no lynch. Augh, it's all so confusing."

So, you see, it's clear to me now that whenever I draw up a list, all three of you end up being mafia. I am left with but one logical conclusion: The Dark Lord Rectangle, His Greatness, Eternal Misery Become of Those Groveling Beneath His Feet--he has seen fit to deliver me to a special hell wherein all three of you are mafia and I'm the lone town.

Even though I walk through the valley of the shadow of death, I will fear no mafia, for Kiyoko is with me; your ships and your cat ears, they comfort me.

████████████████ NIGHT ONE RESULTS...

ALICEOFOZ was killed. She was a LEADER.

████████████████ LEADER

If you are ever killed during the night, the votes for the next day will be completely anonymous. (Players will have to send in their votes via PM rather than posting in thread, and there will be no vote tally.)

ALCASYNC was killed. She was a YAKUZA.

████████████████ YAKUZA

Once in the game, target another player. That player will be converted to mafia, and you will die.

The ratio is 1:1.


For the record, nautilus was the one converted. Was going to send a pm but didn't see the point since the game is over.

Sorry for late rollover

Oohhhhh, congratulations alca!!

This may have been a victory for the mafia, but it was a moral victory for me, because even though the odds and my own original role were against me I bested a giant angry rectangle

Wow, I actually guessed the mafia correctly. My role was "Ghoul".

Kiyoko wrote:████████████████ GHOUL

Choose a player at night. If you are targeted by a killing role, your chosen target will be killed instead. Only works once in the game. If you are not targeted by a kill, your action will not be used up, and you can try again the next night.

I chose Nautilus N0, and then Alcasync N1. If only. I should've tried harder to make her want to attack me, but I had no idea how to do that without being obvious about it.

That was a really fast game. ^_^

OKAY I AM HOME NOW.

I really need to stop scheduling 9pm rollovers. It's the perfect time for me EXCEPT on Mondays where I am guaranteed to be distracted by having too much fun.

Congrats maf!

Thank you all of you for putting up with my weird rectangle and role choices!