Monkey Paw UPick [Day 4]

Something about lindahl doesn't feel right but man what I don't even know, this game is weird as hell and I'm just along for the ride. lindahl said that they thought the ratio mixup was their fault but it wasn't part of their role right? but like if their drawback is the ratio skewing town (I assume that for game purposes the ratio actually counts as 8:3) doesn't that make them... not town...

sorry I could be wrong I just woke up also Blaire how could you //crocodile tears

just kidding I love you and everyone else

Alright, I'm content with Lucas's answer for now. Thanks Lucas!

Back to vote: Cure.

Edit, snaked by doak. Doak, I see what you mean, and didn't think about that when I withheld information. Alright (also @lux), the rollover change is directly related to my weird role ability, and not to any drawbacks. It's also not an every night sort of thing, so things won't get too crazy too fast.

OH MY GOD WHAT IS THAT ??? VOTE I DON'T LIKE IT?

Doak wrote: but like if their drawback is the ratio skewing town (I assume that for game purposes the ratio actually counts as 8:3) doesn't that make them... not town...

It's tough to say. We probably need more examples to draw a better conclusion. It does seem rather anti-town, but then why would we inherently expect a positive effect (I.E. the usage of a town role) to have a positive drawback? That's a bit contradictory.

I can think of a few positive town effects that would have lindahl "pay for the price of magic" by obscuring ratio information, which is crucial for town. The fact that he's been open about it leads me away from being immediately suspicious of him. There are of course scenarios of a scummy lindahl, so it's important to be cautious and mindful.

The only thing I would worry about is how easily he was able to determine it's related to his role. Which is why I'm curious if he thinks it's a drawback or something he explicitly wished for. If the latter, hm. I don't think mafia would know of their alignment before making their first wish? So you could make the case that he started the game with a wish that would obscure alignment information (wanting to try to become mafia, though Kotakia could just make him town), or perhaps it's a situation where a mafia immediately used a second use of the monkey paw to obscure information. I can't see mafia immediately using their second set of wishes, considering town vastly outnumbers them in the wish count and they would lose the war of attrition trying to be so boldly proactive.

I could be wrong, of course, but that's just my interpretation.

Edit: Oh, some replies. Reading, but posting this meanwhile.

Sammiya has been revived.

9:3.

Luxaria wrote:

Doak wrote: but like if their drawback is the ratio skewing town (I assume that for game purposes the ratio actually counts as 8:3) doesn't that make them... not town...

I can think of a few positive town effects that would have lindahl "pay for the price of magic" by obscuring ratio information, which is crucial for town.

I think to really obscure ratio information, alignments of dead people would have to be obscured in rollover? We can always count down from 8:3 based on alignments revealed when people die. Unless Sammiya was in fact NOT town (which I don't believe at all) we know we're at an actual ratio of 7:3 regardless of what's displayed in rollover.

The big question to me is whether the ratio for win condition purposes is counted at 8:3 or 7:3 now...

Also because of this mystery vote I'm going to throw down and vote: Taki the Tender. Sorry! I don't feel lynching Cure is the right thing to do right now and while I don't know many people here and don't have any real reads yet I would rather RNG the lynch in hopes of learning... something. But mostly I just really don't like that ??? vote oh my god??????

OH WELCOME BACK SAMMIE??? DO YOU HAVE ANY... INFORMATION YOU CAN GIVE US...

@ lindahl:

Hmm. I don't know what to think of the fact that it's actually part of your role, to be honest. That seems... odd to me? So you anticipate us receiving accurate ratio information after this lynch? In other words, if Sammiya was killed and was town, then we'd see 7(-1):3(-1), with the -1 being applied to the corresponding faction of whatever target was lynched?

@ Vote:

k.

unvote
Vote: Tiki the Troll

It's probably not moving another vote but rather creating an entire new voting participant, I guess? But just to be safe, re-submitting my vote.

I don't really have reason to suspect Cure, but right now I can't tell if that shadow-vote is from someone scummy or town, and if it's trying to make her appear scummy or town, and to what end, so I'm just going to ignore it tbh.

@ Kotakia edit:

First off, welcome back, Sammiya, but okay hold on.

So the ratio is 9:3. So there's 12 participants, and now we have a shadow vote.

Did someone wish to make a clone of themself or a dummy player? Or wish for another player to join the game? But the vote is the same as lindahl's vote.

lindahl, are you two people?

Edit: Doak posted as I wrote this, submitting and reading.

Doak wrote:I think to really obscure ratio information, alignments of dead people would have to be obscured in rollover? We can always count down from 8:3 based on alignments revealed when people die. Unless Sammiya was in fact NOT town (which I don't believe at all) we know we're at an actual ratio of 7:3 regardless of what's displayed in rollover.

This is true, but I guess I am more or less trying to poke/analyze every bit of rollover information since in a game like this... I have a lot of trouble trusting rollover details. That said, you are correct that alignments of the dead would be obscured to make these changes effective, but I guess this is moot at this point because we have our answer.

So apparently Sammiya was actually killed and the ratio was 8:3, because apparently the resting ratio is 9:3 because there's a shadow ??? thing hiding in this game.

Good thing my role is passive, so I'm not too worried about being lynched. but drandahl is clearly doing fishy things guys and I don't like it. 

vote: tiki the troll because I don't want to be mislynched this early in the game, thanks.  UvU

ummmMMMMMMM two votes for tikitaki since i changed mine???? < O> < O>

guys. Theory on the shadow vote: it's obviously the reason why the ratio is bigger, and it's obviously due to drandahl. He's voting me twice because he's suspicious of me for some reason, yet won't say why. Care to say why you think I'm mafia? No? Alright then!

Doak wrote:ummmMMMMMMM two votes for tikitaki since i changed mine???? < O> < O>

I was the original vote on Tiki the Troll. I just unvoted and re-did it to make sure it was still on him and hadn't been not-so-subtly moved or some such. Probably an unnecessary action since the following revive and ratio information make it seem like the ??? is the 12th "player" of the game, but...

Uh wow okay you tab out for an hour to do actual work and shit happens.

I'm actually... n...ot that suspicious of drandahl. Yeah, he's being scummy by not being forthcoming about information, but he's always kind of like that and you'd think he'd learn because 90% of the time it comes back to bite him in the ass, but hey.

I'm okay with the theory that shadowvote is drandahl, and since I'm not too too suspicious of drandahl at the moment, I also have no reason to vote for Tiki (since I feel like aside from Raiechu going "I don't want to be lynched," the primary reason for voting Tiki seems to be "that vote on Cure is bad news")

I have zero opinions on Raie right now to be honest. And I don't want to vote Doak out since it's one of her first crywolf games. By that reasoning I also shouldn't keep my vote on Aeiou, sooo... Man, I dunno.

unvote, vote: Mr. Alice since she's already got one vote on her and I don't like the other options.